Are you voting in the locals?
Discussion
snuffy said:
After 40 odd years of voting I've finally grasped that it's a total waste of time, you don't get what you voted for, what candidates and parties say they are going to do if you elect them, and what they actually do once elected, bear no resemblance to each other (since there's no legal obligation to enact anything you promise), and also nothing will change.
I actually feel quite dim-witted myself in falling for the lie of "if you don't vote, you can't complain' line for so many years.
So I shall be abstaining on Thursday.
I'm of the same view. I actually feel quite dim-witted myself in falling for the lie of "if you don't vote, you can't complain' line for so many years.
So I shall be abstaining on Thursday.
Sheets Tabuer said:
ClaphamGT3 said:
It is an unpardonable national malaise.
I am not an advocate of compulsory voting, even though I consider anyone who does not vote as a dim-witted societal parasite, but I do consider the small and dwindling voter turn-out at elections to be a real weakness in society.
I personally believe that citizenship and constitution should be taught much more seriously in our primary and secondary skills, with heavy focus on the democratic process and the consequences of ignoring it.
But nothing changes, the lives of ordinary people isn't made better by voting and certainly not in local elections.I am not an advocate of compulsory voting, even though I consider anyone who does not vote as a dim-witted societal parasite, but I do consider the small and dwindling voter turn-out at elections to be a real weakness in society.
I personally believe that citizenship and constitution should be taught much more seriously in our primary and secondary skills, with heavy focus on the democratic process and the consequences of ignoring it.
In 50 years on this planet I've not once seen any party do anything that made a difference to my life.
It demonstrates stability in our system of governance regardless of who holds power and one of the few things that makes the UK an attractive place to invest. We don't do multi-party coalitions or tolerate ultra right or left wing politics. I know this doesn't seem like it at times but that is the reality. You don't actually want any government to make a direct difference to your life. What you want them to do is ensure that your life can be led in a fair and safe environment.
Governments have made a difference to your life, though. It may not be apparent but your education will have been better than that which your parents received. Same with healthcare and transport. Economic opportunity has improved and many more. Whether or not you have capitalised upon these things is entirely down to you.
On your first point, this is where a tangible difference is felt. When the government talks of a 'Northern Powerhouse' - that's of little consequence if you live in Basingstoke. But if the local council axe or add local bus routes, hire or fire 50 care workers, approve or deny a local development.... all these affect you directly in the here and now. Your MP has very little, if any influence over these things but those you vote to represent your immediate neighbourhood, do.
I would suggest that greater consideration is needed over local elections than national.
SpidersWeb said:
Where I live used to be split 50/50 Conservative / LibDem in the town and district council, with only a rare independent. However in the council elections in the years following 2010 the LibDems were annihilated and lost every single seat as they came up for re-election.
What did the former LibDem councillors do - that's right they stood as independents and people felt they could vote for someone as an independent even though the campaign literature was exactly the same as when they were LibDems and as individuals they still campaigned for the LibDems in the GEs.
And when they were elected they formed an 'Independent Group' with exactly the same councillors as used to be in the LibDem group.
So all that would happen if you prohibited political parties in local councils would be independents standing as part of groups that were not officially affiliated with the party but still followed that party's line, but without any of the oversight that comes from the party.
Unfortunately I think there is a lot of truth to this. We have a number of "independent" candidates who are suspiciously similar to some Tory ones from a few years ago.What did the former LibDem councillors do - that's right they stood as independents and people felt they could vote for someone as an independent even though the campaign literature was exactly the same as when they were LibDems and as individuals they still campaigned for the LibDems in the GEs.
And when they were elected they formed an 'Independent Group' with exactly the same councillors as used to be in the LibDem group.
So all that would happen if you prohibited political parties in local councils would be independents standing as part of groups that were not officially affiliated with the party but still followed that party's line, but without any of the oversight that comes from the party.
Decisions taken by local government arguably have more impact on day to day life than Westminster. Education, policing, bins, roads, local services etc on a daya to day basis, as opposed to twiddling with 1% here and there on tax and fretting about dinghies.
If you have a vote it should be used at every opportunity.
If you have a vote it should be used at every opportunity.
Edited by abzmike on Wednesday 1st May 09:50
I wish TV & newspapers didn't insist on using local elections as an indicator of how people will vote in the next general election.
I vote for the candidate not the party. Having people on local councils that don't follow the party line is, to my mind, a good thing. I want a focus on local issues. I often vote for candidates not from the main parties or independants.
I vote for the candidate not the party. Having people on local councils that don't follow the party line is, to my mind, a good thing. I want a focus on local issues. I often vote for candidates not from the main parties or independants.
Sheets Tabuer said:
But nothing changes, the lives of ordinary people isn't made better by voting and certainly not in local elections.
Actually you probably have more chance of making more of a difference to your life in local elections. 20 mph zones, LTN, potholes, number of bins required, etc, etc. Saying that I moved a couple of months ago and still haven't registered to vote so will not be voting this time around.
Mostly agree with you on national elections given what we have seen.
Edited by JagLover on Wednesday 1st May 10:16
abzmike said:
Decisions taken by local government arguably have more impact on day to day life than Westminster. Education, policing, bins, roads, local services etc on a daya to day basis, as opposed to twiddling with 1% here and there on tax and fretting about dinghies.
Perhaps, but when you live somewhere that has a town council, a district council, a county council, and a regional mayor, with some being Conservative, some independent (or rather fake independent LibDems), and some Labour because of the weird combination of areas they cover, then when anyone raises an issue about education, policing, bins, roads, local services etc. they all just point a finger at the others and blame them.And then they continue on as before wasting money and achieving nothing.
PurplePenguin said:
snuffy said:
tangerine_sedge said:
Same here, but I'll be going out of my way to spoil my ballot paper.
And what do you think that will accomplish?And not one single person gives a monkey's toss.
Will i vote? Yes.
Do i think it will make any difference to my life? Nope, not one bit.
Only councillor to come to the door was local Tory. Which given it's a lib dem held council says to me LD either expect to get re-elected or they can't be bothered to come and see anyone face to face for the deserved abuse.
I've become so jaded about the whole show I don't know if I will bother to vote.
Lifelong Tory, but they aren't a party I can support now. But who is an alternative, labour certainly won't improve matters and no one else is likely to get enough votes. I firmly believe that we have too many choices, they just take votes away from the main 3 (2 really) meaning you get false results in anything other than a landslide. This election cons are quite likely to lose because the racist party (did I spell that correctly?) have pulled all the extremists and morons out of the mix. In the same way as it old Jezza started up the communist party he would take the wind out of labours sails.
Do I want to be involved in any way with a party that courts extremist morons, absolutely not. But their vote unfortunately counts. Till there is an IQ test as a part of voting criteria then you are stuck with the fact that everyone's vote is equal.
Round here Tories are unlikely to lose their seat in the locals, if they do it will be to labour. What will change? Best case nothing, worst case they will go bankrupt. Our PCC has just come up with yet another anti motorist scheme, would a labour version be suddenly pro motorist? Of course he wouldn't.
In the general election what would likely change for me? Well likely labour would put a hold on the rolling historic vehicle tax rule like last time or cut it completely, but I don't think I would generally be worse off. My Dad said something a while ago which has played on my mind ever since, he's anti labour, but has always felt better off under labour than conservatives. And I think he's right. I think I was too. But I'm also not naive enough to think I would be this time as every time we have a change it seems to get a bit worse every time. It's like a one way ratchet system.
Signed
Bored and Jaded of Acacia Avenue.
Lifelong Tory, but they aren't a party I can support now. But who is an alternative, labour certainly won't improve matters and no one else is likely to get enough votes. I firmly believe that we have too many choices, they just take votes away from the main 3 (2 really) meaning you get false results in anything other than a landslide. This election cons are quite likely to lose because the racist party (did I spell that correctly?) have pulled all the extremists and morons out of the mix. In the same way as it old Jezza started up the communist party he would take the wind out of labours sails.
Do I want to be involved in any way with a party that courts extremist morons, absolutely not. But their vote unfortunately counts. Till there is an IQ test as a part of voting criteria then you are stuck with the fact that everyone's vote is equal.
Round here Tories are unlikely to lose their seat in the locals, if they do it will be to labour. What will change? Best case nothing, worst case they will go bankrupt. Our PCC has just come up with yet another anti motorist scheme, would a labour version be suddenly pro motorist? Of course he wouldn't.
In the general election what would likely change for me? Well likely labour would put a hold on the rolling historic vehicle tax rule like last time or cut it completely, but I don't think I would generally be worse off. My Dad said something a while ago which has played on my mind ever since, he's anti labour, but has always felt better off under labour than conservatives. And I think he's right. I think I was too. But I'm also not naive enough to think I would be this time as every time we have a change it seems to get a bit worse every time. It's like a one way ratchet system.
Signed
Bored and Jaded of Acacia Avenue.
Gassing Station | News, Politics & Economics | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff